Problems with auto update to IS2013
When my IS updated itself to the 2013 version, I got several issues:
- Twice the fire wall was inactivated. (Could possibly be coincidence; has never happened before though.)
- In the Status window the first item "Virus scanning" (original messages in Swedish, my translation) displays an exclamation point, the slider is green though the text prior to the slider says "Updating", and has done so for two-three days.
- Several components (CCF network 1.2.128, Onsline Safety 2.77.1170, Computer Security 12.77.100) list as "Not Installed" and one component (F-S Hydra Update 2013-03-01_05) lists as "Failed" (original messages in Swedish, my translation).
- The banking protection (which b.t.w. scared the wits out of me when it appeared, as I didn't know it existed...) states "%PRODUCT_NAME% has switched on [...]", which indicates something is missing.
- The message box announcing an available product upgrade also contains a place holder or variable name instead of a company name: "A free upgrade is available from {@Localization\Customizable\Strings
peratorName}" (original messages in Swedish, my translation).
Something apparently got stuck in the update process, and I have no indication or idea as to what happened. What could be the best way forward?
Comments
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I recently made the upgrade manually, and had to try twice. The first time, I was expecting a pop-up at end to ask me to reboot, but the installaiton window just disappeared and then nothing happened. I waited for some time, and then started the F-SecureNetworkInstallerUpg.exe again. Again, nothing seemed to be happening after the window closed, but this time I just sat and waited. Eventually, a pop-up came and asked me to reboot.
If you haven't had the patience to wait for this, you may have gotten into trouble.
Today, I have experienced lots of trouble with a reinstall. I have a fresh new computer and installed F-Secure on it, but Computer Security was not running. Rebooting the computer didn't help, but when I installed or uninstalled some other software and rebooted, FSIS sometimes worked, sometimes not. I still don't know if the problem is with some other software or not. Anyway, I ended up uninstalling FSIS and reinstalling it, and that gave me even more tourble. The first time I noticed that now F-Secure thinks I have FSIS installed on three computers, which is not the case. I suspected this may have happened because I may have made the first installation on the new computer via WLAN, and perhaps FSIS found a different MAC address. So today I tried to do uninstall over WLAN and then install over LAN. But the reinstall got stuck in a strange way, and eventually I could not eeven try to do a reinstall; the installer just said it failed. After much much perspiration I managed to run the installaiton again, but the problem I was trying to solve stil persists. F-Secure still thinks I have done the installaiton on three computers. My knee-jerk reaction is that also the uninstall had something still running in the backgrouund while I attemted the reinstall, and that got everything mixed up.
Having a silent process in the background confuses the user much too much. F-Secure, please, make sure that users can see that the installation still has not completed as long as there is a background proces still doing something. Do not hide it. The user gets into very bad and frustrating situaitons because of the hidden process. Please please please fix this.
In both cases, I was installing FSIS 2013 Release 3, and on both computers I have Windows 7 (Home on the upgrade computer, and Professional on the new one).
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Hello,
I think that most of issues that you mention may be solved by performing a clean installation of FSIS (assuming there is no other security solution installed already on your computer, no matter how tiny it be). I would try first by uninstalling the whole FSIS from Windows Control Panel, be patient in the process and if everything went right Windows will ask you to reboot. In any case, whether uninstalling was successful or not (got stuck or failed), it is advised to run the FS uninstallation tool afterwards: ftp://ftp.f-secure.com/support/tools/uitool/UninstallationTool.exe Save it to your desktop, run it and follow instructions. Please be patient, as the system may automatically restart once the process is completed.
As last step, you can perform the clean install of the Suite (again, be patient on installing):
F-Secure Internet Security 2013 (Release 3) Swedish: http://www.f-secure.com/sv/web/home_se/support/installers
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I don't know whom you replied to, but I'll chime in anyway.
In my case, the uninstall tool didn't do its job properly. In the first uninstall, I first tried the tool, then resorted to Control Panel and that worked much better. In the second uninstall, which got jammed, the uninstall tool just opened and closed and did nothing at all. Eventually I had just one process, fshoster32, running. I killed it then deleted the installation directory, well tried, but it failed because fshoster32 was running again. So I killed it again and got the directory destroyed. After that, I still had to clean registry and restart computer before the installer managed to do its job.
When I said I suspect some other software for the trouble, I mean the pre-installed sw that came with my new Lenovo Thinkpad E530. It comes with loads and loads of crap that I have had to uninstall one by one. I haven't had time to install anything much, just Firefox on such.
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Hi Hono,
Sorry for the confusion. I was trying to assist original poster, Suf.
You wrote: "I first tried the tool, then resorted to Control Panel and that worked much better." In your case, and how it's always advised for all installed software, I think it would have been better to remove it in the other way around?
Then you said: "In the second uninstall, which got jammed, the uninstall tool just opened and closed and did nothing at all." I would say then the Suite was probably uninstalled properly before.
Anyway, I think you are doing the right thing, by getting rid of the tons of preinstalled software that came with your Lenovo. I know a free tool that can help in this regard http://pcdecrapifier.com/
Then, when you have spare time and/or you are in the mood, you might want to try the whole clean installation procedure of FSIS 2013 mentioned in my previous post.
PS. I personally like PowerTools (Macecraft) for my registry cleaning needs, I use it particularly after every software uninstallations.
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At the point when the uninstall tool only opened and closed and did nothing, there was still the fshoster32 running, so F-Secure definitely was not properly uninstalled yet. My theory of how it got into a knot is that when I did the uninstall (from control panel, at that time), and didn't get a pop-up for reboot, I assumed that this brand new release doesn't need the reboot anymore, and immediately proceeded to being a new installation. WHile I was running it, the uninstall must have been working in the background. After the install, I saw a pop-up asking me to reboot, but I didn't check if it was from uninstall or install. I rebooted, and expected to have F-Secure running, but it wasn't. The fshoster32 was the only process. SO the uninstall must have been wreaking havoc with the installation process. And in this situation, the uninstall tool didn't do anything at all.
So you see why I am asking F-Secure to make sure that none of the uninstal and install phases are done by a hidden process that user cannot see.
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Hi Hono,
Well, I have to agree with what you said in your last paragraph.
Yes, I think that the uninstalling tool always does its job behind the scenes, at least that's one of the directions that I received days ago from Mr. Bathumalai, a tech-support engineer:
"6. Uninstallation will run as a background process.
7. Your computer will automatically restart once uninstallation process complete."So in your case it's clear that this tool totally messed up the correct uninstallation of the Suite, since as you said above, the user ignores beforehand when it is actually working. A kind of notice or better yet, a always-on window that shows uninstallation status is highly recommended to be included on the tool.
In my case, on the other hand, I fortunately followed the way I always use to uninstall apps, by going the ControlPanel first before using the uninst. tool.
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No, you got it wrong. After the first time when I tried the uninstall tool first, I had learned my lesson and second time I started the uninstall via Control Pane. But this uninstall showed a window that closed without asking for reboot, and after waiting for several minutes, I proceeded to doing a new install. That too ended without asking for a reboot, but again several minutes later I saw a pop-up asking for reboot, and I didn't chck the window title. I just rebooted. And then I was in a mess.
You cannot blame that on the uninstall tool. It was the uninstall I launched via Control panel that caused the whole havoc, together with F-SecureNetworkInstallerUpg.exe. While I was in the mess, I tried also the uninstall tool, but it didn't do anything at all, and eventually also the netinstall just failed.
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Hi macstorm,
Thanks for Your advice! I got basically the same from FS support (they replied today, reasonably promptly after the week end, also to a follow up question I had), except they said nothing about beginning with a Windows uninstall of FSIS. What would be Your argument in favour of starting in that end?
Also, approximately how long (what ballpark: x minutes? y hours?) will the FS uninstall take, and then how long the clean install of FSIS 2013? (I understand the computer has to be left alone until it restarts, so I'd like to know what to expect.)
General grumbling: there should be a "repair" facility/function for cases like this...
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We were discussing the two choices. One is to uninstall via Control Panel, and that method is preferred. The other is to download the uninstall tool from support, but that method is only in case the first method doesn't work.
In my case, the "first uninstall" (and subsequent reinstall) happened about a week ago and maybe I was more patient or something, it went well eventually. Yesterday, I tried to get rid of the extraneous subscription that F-Secure shows to me, and in doing that one, I was not patient and started a reinstall before uninstall had finished. Thus happened because I did not see anything was going on. Only after the reinstall, I saw a process cia Task Manager that clearly was related to installer (or uninstaller), and that is how I know there was a hidden process still running although both the uninstall window and the install window had already closed.
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Hi Hono,
Got it.
Well, I'm running Windows 8 and here I was asked to reboot after using the ControlPanel. Now I get why you had come across that mess. In your case, F-Secure tech-support is required. (I'd also try to restore Lenovo settings, since it's new, to defaults... but that's me).
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I finally got the reinstall done, I dont' need help with that anymore. But I still have that extra subscription there. Can you tell me if I am right in assuming that happened because I did the first install over WLAN and the second (and all attempts since) over LAN? I mean, is it because LAN and WLAN having dofferent MAC addresses? That is the onyl guess I am educated enough to make.
As for the first time uninstall&reinstall, the problem was that Computer Security was not starting. My knee-jerk reaction was to do a reinstall. It didn't help, and I looked up for help here, and found two users who had had the same problem on a Lenovo, and they bpth said that uninstalling RapidBoot Shield helped. I did that, but it didn't help. However, the problem with Computer Security comes and goes away rather unexpectedly. Every time it appears or reapperars, I have either uninstalled some of the Lenovo crap or installed something more useful. So even though disabling the RapidBoot thingy didn't help, I suspect it still might have something to do with the low-level optimizations that can be contorlled via BIOS. I have now disabled Intel Hyper-Threading and have fingers crossed, hoping that next time I install or uninstall something the problem with Computer Security won't reapperar.
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Hi Suf,
If you got contacted by tech-support then just follow their instructions carefully. I couldn't tell on what to expect when using the uninstalling tool, since as I said before, when I was contacted by them I tried removing it from Control Panel first (the other way around) and this did the job.
I don't know how long it will take when using the F-Secure uninstalling tool, just keep in mind that it will do its job silently in the background and when it finishes your pc will automatically reboot. Do not try to force the restart.
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Hi Hono,
I'm glad to hear that you finally got it installed correctly.
Not sure, but I don't think the LAN stuff had anything to do with the mess.
A thing came to my mind just ago, what preinstalled security solution had your Lenovo before? I don't want to think that an incomplete removal of the previous "Suite" was the culprit
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Lenovo comes with pre-installed Norton, and F-Secure tried to uninstall it, but failed, so I uninstalled it myself, and then continued with F-Secure installation. It seemed to go well, but after reboot, Computer Security wasn't running. So I downloaded the Norton removal tool, ran it, and it didn't help. I reinstalled F-Secure and that didn't help. Then I did various other things, and after a reboot or another, Computer Security was running - until after several other reboots, it stopped again, and this continued and continued. The hint about RapidBoot kind of seems like a closer match, although it didn't prove out to be the right one. Anyway, at some point in the midst of it, I checked the subscription and found three subscriptions when I expected to find two, one for my old laptop and another for the new. Frankly, I can't believe Norton had anything to do with that one.
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Hi Hono,
I got scared when you just said that let FS to automatically uninstall Norton. Not even in my worst nightmares I'd dare to get rid of Norton that way, then again that's why ControlPanel is for, and just as last resort if something goes wrong people can look to 3rd party tools. Once, I tried Norton AV for several days, then when I removed it through CP and subsequent reboot, I applied the NRT for extra safety, you know this vendor have always had reputation of leaving many waste after uninstalls.
For what it is worth, I'd like to tell something. I had to install FSIS twice from my initial usage, first was an upgrade on top of previous FSAV trial (I was told by a tech-support guy, upgrading over an existent FS product is totally harmless). The next time, I was asked to do it to solve an issue with the BankingProtection feature, it was not detecting the secured website address of my bank. On both installs and subsequent reboots, FSIS seemed to keep "autoupdating and stabilizing" modules afterwards, with Windows Action Center acting strange and hardly detecting the protection of FSIS. I'd say just about half-hour later the Suite was completely settled.
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I think FSIS has always tried to uninstal any "offending" software, as FSIS calls it.
However, the method of leaving a hidden process to finish the installation came with the netinstall version, I believe. Using such a ghost method leaves way too much room for user erros. Pulling the user in into the mix, even if (or especially) by accident, makes the whole thing so much less reliable. What a horror. I fully agree that there should only be one window that stays put through the whole installation. Having a separate pop-up to for the reboot message cuts off the context quite completely.
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Hi
I would like to comment on a few things. I work in R&D and I know exactly how it works.
There are no hidden processes left in installation. The only thing that is not done when you see the installation finished page is Computer Security virus databases, which are still being downloaded. The user is protected by DeepGuard and minimal databases until that completes.
I think the confusion comes from the upgrade. If you already have existing installation and run the upgrade tool, it will trigger the download of the upgrade but will not show anything until the channel upgrade is ready to be applied (or in some cases already applied). I fully agree that this is not a good solution and we are going to improve it in future.
The ghost licenses appear when using uninstallation tool. The server does not receive notification of uninstallation and reserves the license for the previous installation that was wiped. Proper way of uninstalling is through Control Panel.
You should not be too concerned about the ghost licenses though - if you install with all licenses used, you get the choice to move used license to the new installation. That will automatically, through some quite complex rules, use the ghost licenses first.
Ville
Ville
F-Secure R&D, Desktop products
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Hi
Uninstallation tool is very crude way of removing the product. It just deletes the files and registry entries and kills the processes. It should be used only if the normal uninstallation does not work. It gets the job done, but standard uninstallation is, how to put it, more elegant.
Support is sometimes too eager to give the uninstallation tool, since they normally deal with situations where the computer is already messed up and normal uninstallation does not work.
Ville
Ville
F-Secure R&D, Desktop products
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Hi Ville,
Thanks for the explanation!
OK, so this is a slightly "messed up" case (the upgrade went awry and I have some unfinished, **bleep** version right now); I assume then the uninstall tool tool may be called for.
A general remark: I was not at all aware that any upgrade was taking place. Thus I may have done something (like turn off or snooze the computer or whatever) that interfered with the process.
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Ville:
In my case, I was doing an uninstall and re-install, and not an automatic upgrade. Both the uninstall and the install have teh same problem: the window that tasks for reboot is a spearate window from the one I opened when I began the install or uninstall. Also, the time gap between these two windows is long. When I see the reboot pop-up long after the first window has closed, I know there is a hidden process that was working that I didn't see. This is what I mean by "ghost process". What I ask form F-Secure is to keep the first window in place over the whole install or uninstall procedure, and then display the reboot text in that same window. That way I know not to reboot prematurely or begin an install before the uninstall has ended, or any other such thing that will mess up the computer.
By having that gap between the first window and the reboot window you are inviting the user to mess up, and the longer the time between the two (it can be tens of minutes), the more you invite the user to mess up. Seriously. -
Hi,
I have not heard of such behaviour with the client before this. The longest period without user visible dialog should be maximally about 5 seconds, when switching the installation from the "stub" installer to the proper installer. You are right that the process showing the installation progress switches there. In the upgrade there is similar scenario since the user interface that starts the upgrade must be shut down for the upgrade - then the progress dialog jumps to another temporary process.
Install, uninstall and upgrade have system wide locking mechanisms that prevent them from running at the same time, so it's not possible to mess up the computer that way.
Ville
Ville
F-Secure R&D, Desktop products
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Thank you Ville, we're getting somewhere now.
What I have witnessed is definitely longer than 5 seconds. Even in the first installation in which I was much more patient (=I was busy writing down all kinds of things to document the steps of taking a new computer into use), it was so many minutes that when the reboot pop-up finally appeared, it surprised me completely. I already had thought that reboot is not needed with the new installer. At that point, I had not even opened the network connection at all until I was ready to use the net installer, which requires connection, so all I had on the laptop was fresh from Lenovo's package. I have no trouble accusing Lenovo for causing the problem initially, but I do need you to acknowledge that there is a possibility for a problem you haven't anticipated. Since that first installation, I have done a successful uninstall&reinstall, and then, later, the botched-up uninstall and reinstall. In all these cases, for unistall and install both, the reboot pop-up took a long time to appear. Waaay too long.
Please take this seriously.
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Just in case someone is online right now:
I am now TRYING to uninstall (with the FS utility).
- After 1½h nothing visible has happened.
- There is a process uninstaller.exe running, utilising approx 20% CPU, which slowly eats memory - presently 1.4 GB of RAM (67% of physical memory).
- There is also a process UninstalaltionTool.exe, utilising only 4,440 kB, that sits there.
- Desk top icon F-secure Launch pad is intact.
- Two processes, fshoster32.exe and FSLAUNCHER0.EXE are still present.
I am logged in on an admin account, and have been doing nothing else with the computer until posting this.
When should I give up?
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Hi Ville,
Thank you for confirming it.
Then I'm glad I didn't follow instructions verbatim when I received response from support, since there wasnt' a word about using regular uninstallation first. Uninstallation tools should always be used as last resort if normal removal doesn't work
) here, should I or should I NOT use the Windows uninstall facility? FS themselves did not include it in their advice, so I'm inclined not to.
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